Beware of Microsoft bearing gifts…
They don’t give a shit anymore. The business customers are paying for 365 and the gamers are paying for gamepass. Those are the money makers now. If you want you can run windows, but if you’re still running windows apps (including 365) then Microsoft still gets paid.
FYI - the owner of this site, gamingonlinux, was a mod on the [email protected] community until they were caught abusing their moderator powers. Then they deleted their account and complained on mastodon that it’s stupid design that mod logs are public.
That’s one of the things I love in lemmy. Moderation transparency.
I really dislike that guy. I was interested in his website but lost interest because of him. I already forgot why I started disliking him. But this just adds to that.
I’m boosting this and the screenshots too, but just thought I’d point out for quick scrollers that it does not seem as dramatic as this comment initially lets you believe.
I mean it’s awkward, but just seems more like your usual social awkwardness/incompetence than malicious behavior as such.
I agree that the main interaction was mild, but if they were willing to go this far to try to hide this, then that shows how low the bar is for them to try to manipulate things to their favor and liking with the trust that was given them as a moderator.
Do you have any sources for this?
Deleted comment:
I called them out for not following their own community rules:
Please be nice to other members. Anyone not being nice will be banned. Keep it fun, respectful and just be awesome to each other.
and they deleted their account.
Thanks! Not quite as wild as I was expecting (kind of surprised this was enough to push them to delete their account)
Probably decided “fuck this” and quit volunteering instead of dealing with drama llamas.
What was wrong with them removing your comment? You were being annoying 🤷♂️
Their response seemed perfectly measured to someone being needlessly pedantic.
Edit: And also Shuts down? Did you miss the ‘down’? Was the title edited after the fact? What does the rest of that modlog say? The screenshot is cropped.
My perspective is you were being annoying, got downvoted/called out, feigned shock, got your comments removed, and now you’re on a bitter smear campaign.
This is the weakest accusation of mod abuse I’ve seen. Good grief.
Yes, their comment was extremely annoying, both in tone (whining) and content (TL;DR: “pls spoonfeed me basic reading comprehension”). If the mod simply removed the comment, or issued an official warning, it would be 100% warranted.
However, what the non-mod user is saying ITT about moderator abuse is still spot on. The mod in question answered to the whining in tone, tried to cover their own arse with content removal, and then went to whine in Mastodon about the events, or the fact that there’s transparency functionality in Lemmy (the mod log) against the exact same behaviour that they showed there.
So it’s a case where both sides were wrong but given their relative positions the mod being wrong is a bigger deal.
Yeah I would ban 24 hours and continue with life.
Yes, their comment was extremely annoying, both in tone (whining) and content (TL;DR: “pls spoonfeed me basic reading comprehension”). If the guy simply removed the comment, or issued an official warning, it would be 100% warranted.
It’s your right to have an opinion on whether or not you think I was annoying. However, the rest of that is just wrong and needlessly rude. My comment was only to point out how many different ways the title could be interpreted without being explicit in what happened. There is no need to be so rude with your wild assumption. I just found the title to be mildly frustrating due to being vague because of the missing word, and I thought I would express that. Does that warrant moderation action? No. It breaks no rules and there was no intent to be disrespectful, nor is there any real tangible proof of any disrespectful intent.
I absolutely agree with you but it didn’t really need to be said did it?
You 100% understood what the title was saying, so complaining that the title was ambiguous, and barely so, was pointless wasn’t it?
Clearly everyone else agreed since you were downvoted.
I don’t agree with you, but you can think all you want about how annoying or pointless my comment was. That is no excuse for their response, then they doubled down and tried to hide it by abusing their moderator powers. That’s the only part of this that matters.
I agree with you, but what does a moderator do once they engage with the user other than remove the whole interaction? They deleted the whole thread, not just their opposition.
Seems like the the whining on mastadon about transparency was more because this guy is following them around harrassing them via public modlog screenshots, when on any other forum it wouldn’t even matter… unless it actually mattered.
In this situation, my view is OP made a mess, pissed jannie added to the mess, OP feigned shock, pissed jannie thought better and cleaned the mess up.
Yet OP here is still trying to stir the pot like the mod was silencing their opinion or something. It was a worthless comment.
edit: oh my god he’s been copypasting this for months LMAO I’m done. God.
I agree with you, but what does a moderator do once they engage with the user other than remove the whole interaction?
You think before engaging. And if you fuck it up, you apologise to the community (not to that specific user) for what you’ve done wrong. But unless the content is sensitive (for example, the other user posted something illegal), you keep it alone, at most you lock it.
Lemmy is too small and this snafoo is so pointless that I think a community apology would be hilarious.
I think the punishment should fit the crime. Having some weirdo follow your posts around calling you manipulative and toxic for months is just… its too much. It’s a linux gaming forum, some social ineptitude is to be expected. Users shouldn’t feel entitled to continuously attack a mod who “mod abused” them with the assault equivalent of a light shove.
It’s just the most insulated privileged non-problem, my god.
Seems like the the whining on mastadon about transparency was more because this guy is following them around harrassing them via public modlog screenshots
Baseless accusation. Got any proof?
yes. this thread lol
“Annoying” is subjective, and there is no rule against being perceived as being “annoying” in the community rules.
The only rule is to be respectful, which they did not follow at all, then tried to hide it.
Response to edit: yes, it was edited after it was brought up. The modlog is public, there’s no need for me to try to hide anything like they tried to do. If you’re going to try to give me shit for that, why do they get a free pass?
Nothing they did appears to have negatively altered the quality of the comments or discussion.
Respect is also subjective. Your initial post seemed to be mocking and disrespectful for no apparent reason. I’d argue the comment section is more respectful with your remarks gone.
Objectively, it appears they were right to delete their account. You’re stalking posts mentioning their site and complaining about this nothing burger.
I would also distance myself from pedantic harrassers and focus on literally anything else productive if I were them.
Are you Liam in disguise or something? Why are you trying to make up shit like I’m “stalking” posts mentioning their site? I’m a user of Lemmy just the same as anyone else and when I see posts that bring up this toxic person’s site, I can easily help inform people of their gross manipulative behavior.
There isn’t even some grand “toxic” or “manipulative” coverup. The mod deleted the whole interaction because it was pointless and rude from both of you. It added nothing.
The jannie took out the trash and you’re still harrassing them about the subjectivity of annoyance and respect. Y’know who makes that subjective choice? The mods.
I have no ties to this, but I am in opposition to this neat little narrative you appear to be creating tossing out buzzwords like toxic, gross, manipulative without evidence to back it up.
All moderators should be assumed to be abusers. Acab
Well yeah that’s why the mod log is public. It’s a feature not a bug
Exafuckingly, no moderators should be offended by what I said, it’s a truism. Transparency is just the first step, there should not be “a” moderator, it is a collective duty that all must participate and that none of us can be trusted alone with.
Fuck that guy.
lemmy.ml doing .ml-things
What does this comment mean. No other communities have bad moderators?
Oh they absolutely do, but ml has a reputation for being particularly poorly moderated
.world has been putting in work to catch up lately
And it’s a behaviour that stems from the admins who’ll ban users from the entire instance if they disagree with their opinions.
It’s the only instance I have blocked at my account level so I don’t see their communties.
Someone on that page commented:
“It was always open source. They just bought the company who created* and maintained, it, moved the devs over to their own fork and closed down the original, graciously allowing the wine team to maintain their own fork of the old code, as if they needed a permission, lol. It’s a good PR move (also for Wine, mind you) but nothing else.”
Microsoft gives the Wine team infectious mononucleosis. Got it.
But seriously, Microsoft is nobody’s friend and shouldn’t be trusted.
In an organization as large as MS there have to be a few good guys. Just don’t let the corporate leadership hear about it.
I know a lot of folk that work at MS or have worked there, they are all very good people. They are highly motivated professionals that are top in their field. MS is a rich company and they recruit the best they can. However those are not the people making any kind of decisions. And it’s a cut throat company, if the budget gets cut, you are out on your ass. At least in most of the world, where strong employee protection isn’t a thing.
Don’t get me wrong, MS has a lot of bad apples just like any other company. Useless managers who say dumb shit and take praise for other peoples work. A leadership that doesn’t care about anything except their bonuses and the bottom line. But at least as far as the engineers go, there’s plenty of really good folk.
People also seem to forget how huge MS actually is. And a lot of the time the different branches within the company are as far away from each other as can be. Even within the same branch one can only talk to so many people.
TIL that Mono is a Microsoft project. I always thought it was an open source reverse engineered .NET
It was only a Microsoft project the moment they bought Xamarin.
Wasn’t Ximian behind it at some point?
I am no Microsoft fanboy, but I get the impression people are a bit overly skeptical here.
I think this is fairly obvious. They have no further use for it, they can either let it rot or they can do the tiniest bit of effort and get some positive PR. It might also just be as simple as an initiative from some employees.
Wasn’t it open source all the time? The article spins it more like microsoft don’t want to shepherd the project any more, another group takes over?
Isn’t it just less work for m$ or what am I missing?
That’s my take too
Edit: Yup, Microsoft kindly abandoned their work to others.
Read the headline and thought “there’s a catch…”
Finally got around to reading the post and Microsoft is very politely saying “we’ve completed stealing their shit now. Don’t know why anyone would want it, use ours now. You can have it though.”
Thanks I guess? I’m glad it’s out of their hands now and with an open source group that cares and can make a difference.
What’s the twist? There must be some reason.
What’s the twist? There must be some reason.
.NET runs natively on Linux since quite some time. Honestly, I don’t get what Mono is even good for these days. Maybe reverse engineering old .NET versions.
.NET runs natively on Linux
Only
.NET CoresadlyWhen I moved my personal laptop to Linux I needed WINE to run some source-available .NET apps that were written targeting the Windows-only
.NET Framework
They officially don’t care about running .NET applications on Linux anymore. They never really did before but so few people fell for that trap Microsoft is finally ready to turn in the towel
What the hell are you talking about?!
They are saying very little in Linux world moved to .NET/C# : https://qa.debian.org/popcon.php?package=mono
It’s just not popular in Linux world despite MS attempts to make it so. It’s a Windows people language.
If nothing else, a lot of (containerized) .NET (web) services run on Linux. Also note that .NET apps can be packed as standalone (ignore the size) and as such are as any other standalone app.
You got some stats? The Debian stats say no one is using it on the desktop or traditional server stuff. I can believe Windows C# Dev are porting their closed service to Linux to improve, well, everything.
No stats, just what I see and consider logically. If you have a .NET (web) app, it makes sense to run it (for free) under Linux (directly or using docker/kubernetes/etc.) instead of paying Windows server license. Sadly I don’t see download counter for dotnet linux images but they would be some sort of an indicator. I can believe Desktop apps are not many, though, for historical reasons mostly. But now one can create a standalone nice looking app as well, perhaps they will be more frequent in future, who knows.
I think it will remain a Windows dev thing. Even if they sometimes use Linux as a runtime. Linux devs will use Python or something else. PHP is legacy really now. Go is popular for apps started at a certain time, but Rust seams to be replacing it. Which is good as Go is as Google as C# is MS.
I can’t help but think that Microsoft has decided to proceed in some way that will break compatibility, so they’re done with Mono now.
I know it’s skeptical, but I just have no faith in that company to act in good faith with anything.
I can’t help but think that Microsoft has decided to proceed in some way that will break compatibility, so they’re done with Mono now.
It’s essentially right there in the article:
Microsoft maintains a modern fork of Mono runtime in the dotnet/runtime repo and has been progressively moving workloads to that fork. That work is now complete, and we recommend that active Mono users and maintainers of Mono-based app frameworks migrate to .NET which includes work from this fork.
We’re done with it, you guys can take the scraps. By the way, ours is better and folks should move to it.
As much as it is beloved, I don’t think windows sees Linux / wine as any kind of substantial threat.
I think they do in the enterprise hosting / software dev world, which is the reason for so much effort being poured into WSL, but for standard client applications or the “average user” switching to Linux I agree
Yeah, they want to be able to get people totally off Linux as a root OS.
By creating WSL, they now can say, "Oh, you like to develop for/on Linux? Well good news, Windows has Linux built in! Just come on over to Windows and you can use WSL and Linux on Azure for all your Linux needs!
And WSL is pretty good according to one of the other guys in my department that’s been using it.
The problem for Microsoft is that my entire user experience is better when I boot straight into Linux and use all their software (except vscode) in browser tabs.
I’ve heard it’s slow as molasses.
dotnet is now a multiplatform framework itself. Do they still need mono?
Is mono not the .net framework version? .net core has always been multi platform, but is not compatible with .net framework apps. So any .net apps built against 3.5 or 4.x would still need to use mono.
Jeezus. Microsoft can’t do anything without people talking crap about them 😂
If someone evades billions in taxes but one day donates 50 dollars it doesn’t absolve their wrongdoings whatsoever. This is just an attempt at trying to improve their image.
In my experience, generally the most vocal contribute the least lol
These corpos are very vocal in arguing to maintain their low tax contributions so perhaps you’re right.
Again, you do realise Mono was started by the same guy who founded Gnome right?
